{"id":44202,"date":"2020-04-30T13:56:35","date_gmt":"2020-04-30T11:56:35","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.justiceinfo.net\/44202-what-can-we-learn-from-perpetrators.html"},"modified":"2020-04-30T13:56:35","modified_gmt":"2020-04-30T11:56:35","slug":"what-can-we-learn-from-perpetrators","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.justiceinfo.net\/en\/44202-what-can-we-learn-from-perpetrators.html","title":{"rendered":"What can we learn from perpetrators?"},"content":{"rendered":"<p><strong>In this new podcast our partners from Asymmetrical Haircuts invite Kjell Anderson, one of the world\u2019s rare \u2018perpetrator experts\u2019 and author of \"Perpetrating Genocide: A Criminological Account\". He talks with Janet Anderson and Stephanie van den Berg about the <a href=\"en\/justiceinfo-comment-and-debate\/opinion\/44014-dominic-ongwen-icc-poster-and-problem-child.html\">Ongwen trial<\/a>, the Rwandan genocide and the former Yugoslavia\u2019s experiences. Stressing that \"the conflicting perspective is actually the correct perspective\" and that \"a lot of perpetrators' stories reflect all the complexities that people have\", this professor at the University of Manitoba (Canada) this week pushes our reflection beyond the normal boundaries.<\/strong><\/p>\n<p><!--more--><\/p>\n<p style=\"text-align: center;\"><em>To listen to the podcast, click on the \"play\" button below:<\/em><\/p>\n<p><iframe loading=\"lazy\" src=\"https:\/\/player.blubrry.com\/id\/59643250\/#time-0&amp;darkOrLight-Light&amp;shownotes-ffffff&amp;shownotesBackground-ffc72c&amp;download-ffffff&amp;downloadBackground-382e2c&amp;subscribe-ffffff&amp;subscribeBackground-9b9593&amp;share-382e2c&amp;shareBackground-ffffff\" width=\"100%\" height=\"138px\" frameborder=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\"><\/iframe><\/p>\n<figure class=\"pull-left\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" title=\"Kjell Anderson\" src=\"media\/Kjell-Anderson_Asymmetrical-Haircuts.jpeg\" alt=\"Kjell Anderson\" width=\"280\" height=\"210\" \/><figcaption>Kjell Anderson \u00a9 Asymmetrical Haircuts<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<p>Just before the Netherland\u2019s intelligent lock down Janet sat down with Kjell Anderson, with Stephanie calling in remotely, to talk about perpetrators and genocide and the myths that surround them both.<\/p>\n<p>Kjell was in town to follow the<a href=\"en\/justiceinfo-comment-and-debate\/opinion\/44014-dominic-ongwen-icc-poster-and-problem-child.html\"> closing arguments<\/a> in the trial of former Lord\u2019s Resistance Army (LRA) commander <a href=\"en\/justiceinfo-comment-and-debate\/opinion\/44014-dominic-ongwen-icc-poster-and-problem-child.html\">Dominic Ongwen<\/a> which is ongoing at the International Criminal Court. Ongwen is a interesting case because he is a former child soldier who made it to the top of the militia that took him as a child and in turn , according to prosecutors, became a perpetrator.<\/p>\n<p><span style=\"boorder: 1px solid #ccc;\"><div class=\"articleLink articleLink--editorRecommanded articleLink--textInImage articleLink--textTop\" style=\"\">\r\n\t\t\t\t\t\r\n\t\t\t<div class=\"articleLinkSurTitle\">Recommended reading<\/div>\r\n\t\t\t<a class=\"articleLinkImageLink\" href=\"https:\/\/www.justiceinfo.net\/en\/44014-dominic-ongwen-icc-poster-and-problem-child.html\"><div class=\"articleLinkImageContainer \"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"540\" height=\"360\" src=\"https:\/\/www.justiceinfo.net\/wp-content\/uploads\/237a89ca7c49965fb001e3ebf85ec0c6-540x360.jpg\" class=\"articleLinkImage backgroundImageTag w-100 wp-post-image\" alt=\"\" srcset=\"https:\/\/www.justiceinfo.net\/wp-content\/uploads\/237a89ca7c49965fb001e3ebf85ec0c6-540x360.jpg 540w, https:\/\/www.justiceinfo.net\/wp-content\/uploads\/237a89ca7c49965fb001e3ebf85ec0c6-730x487.jpg 730w, https:\/\/www.justiceinfo.net\/wp-content\/uploads\/237a89ca7c49965fb001e3ebf85ec0c6-1110x740.jpg 1110w, https:\/\/www.justiceinfo.net\/wp-content\/uploads\/237a89ca7c49965fb001e3ebf85ec0c6.jpg 1200w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 540px) 100vw, 540px\" \/><\/div><\/a>\r\n\t\t\t<a href=\"https:\/\/www.justiceinfo.net\/en\/44014-dominic-ongwen-icc-poster-and-problem-child.html\" class=\"articleLinkTitle articleLinkTitle--default\">\r\n\t\t\tDominic Ongwen: the ICC\u2019s Poster and Problem Child\r\n\t\t<\/a>\r\n\t\t\r\n\t\t\t\t<\/div><\/span><\/p>\n<p>As someone who has interviewed many perpetrators we also asked Kjell about his experiences and what commonalities he saw. Stephanie of course had to bring up that <a href=\"https:\/\/www.nytimes.com\/2020\/01\/16\/opinion\/sunday\/radovan-karadzic.html\">Jessica Stern<\/a>\u2018s controversial New York Times article about her book of interviews with Bosnian Serb leader Radovan Karadzic which set <a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/JasminMuj\/status\/1222204743700951042\">Balkan twitter<\/a> alight.<\/p>\n<p>We also spoke about Kjell\u2019s book, <a href=\"https:\/\/cicj.org\/2017\/11\/perpetrating-genocide-a-criminological-account-by-kjell-anderson\/\">Perpetrating Genocide<\/a>, and how genocides and other acts of mass violence are both organised and spontaneous.<\/p>\n<p>His recommendations include the New York Times podcast<a href=\"https:\/\/www.nytimes.com\/interactive\/2018\/podcasts\/caliphate-isis-rukmini-callimachi.html\"> Califate by Rukimini Callimachi<\/a> who reports on Islamic State and <a href=\"https:\/\/www.theverge.com\/2015\/7\/15\/8971233\/the-act-of-killing-joshua-oppenheimer-interview-the-look-of-silence-documentary\">Joshua Oppenheimer\u2019s<\/a> stunning films <em>The Act of Killing<\/em> and <em>The Look of Silence<\/em> which both take an unusual look at Indonesia\u2019s brutal anti-communist purge in the 1960s.<\/p>\n<p>For books he praises the work of two researchers on Rwanda who really deepened the research into the 1994 genocide there : <a href=\"https:\/\/www.reed.edu\/reed-magazine\/in-memoriam\/obituaries\/2018\/lee-ann-fujii-84.html\">Lee Anne Fujii<\/a> and<a href=\"http:\/\/www.lse.ac.uk\/government\/people\/academic-staff\/omar-mcdoom\"> Omar MacDoom<\/a>.<\/p>\n<div class=\"content-encadre\" style=\"margin-top: 30px;\">\n<p><strong><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"pull-left\" title=\"Asymmetrical Haircuts podcast\" src=\"media\/Asymmetrical-Haircuts-podcast_logo.png\" alt=\"Asymmetrical Haircuts podcast\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/>ASYMMETRICAL HAIRCUTS<br \/><\/strong><\/p>\n<p>This podcast has been published as part of a partnership between JusticeInfo.net and <a href=\"https:\/\/www.asymmetricalhaircuts.com\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow noopener noreferrer\">Asymmetrical Haircuts<\/a>, a podcast on international justice produced from The Hague by journalists Janet Anderson and Stephanie van den Berg, who retain full control and independence over the contents of the podcast.<\/p>\n<\/div>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>In this new podcast our partners from Asymmetrical Haircuts invite Kjell Anderson, one of the world\u2019s rare \u2018perpetrator experts\u2019 and author of \"Perpetrating Genocide: A Criminological Account\". He talks with Janet Anderson and Stephanie van den Berg about the Ongwen trial, the Rwandan genocide and the former Yugoslavia\u2019s experiences. Stressing that \"the conflicting perspective is [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":64,"featured_media":63696,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[569],"tags":[],"ji_location":[2567],"class_list":["post-44202","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-podcast","ji_location-international"],"acf":[],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO Premium plugin v25.3.1 (Yoast SEO v25.3.1) - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>What can we learn from perpetrators? - JusticeInfo.net<\/title>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/www.justiceinfo.net\/en\/44202-what-can-we-learn-from-perpetrators.html\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"What can we learn from perpetrators?\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"In this new podcast our partners from Asymmetrical Haircuts invite Kjell Anderson, one of the world\u2019s rare \u2018perpetrator experts\u2019 and author of &quot;Perpetrating Genocide: A Criminological Account&quot;. 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